Ambush Deck - opinions?

[Newari]

Lance
4x Wyld
4x Skullborn
4x Blake
4x Nightshade
4x Aldon
1x Jasmine Rosecult
4x Assassinate
4x Reconnaissance

Deck Concept:
Rush them and gain board control early with Ambush. Stealth is used to gain control if going second. The Ally curve is quite fast with 8 cards at 1cc, 8 at 2cc, 5 at 3cc. Assassinates for fatties I can't deal with, Recons are useful to give that extra punch to a weenie rush deck without losing card advantage. Everything in this deck costs 3 resources or less so no need of sacrificing cards to 4 unless you are preparing for a global reset and want to put out more creatures right after. This surprisingly gives you good card advantage as you aren't sacrificing as many cards to gain resources. Skullborns help protect against burn to some degree allowing my heavy hitters to survive (Blakes). Blakes can get 5 attack from Aldon and Recons making for a quick kill potential.

Possible Deck Issues:
Card draw - though it may not be needed and the only good options make you lose card advantage which I feel is vital
Item destruction - there may be weapons/armors/onging effects I've yet encountered that will prove to destroy this rush strategy

Possible Deck counters:
Mage/Priest decks seem to be too slow to deal with this rush; just be smart and lookout for global resets they may have. Have just enough creatures to control the board and pound on them and wait for them to use a global reset. Then splash more cheap effecient creatures down to regain board control.
Hunter decks I haven't tested against but I imagine it being tough. Stealth and Ambush work around hero armor/weapons as they can't attack or defend.

Love to hear your thoughts, thanks.

[Atomzed]

When i saw "ambush"'deck, I thought you're going to build your deck around assassin training. But it looks like it's only the usage of Lance ability for the ambush part.

Change i would made? Take out the nightshades and have 4 Jasmines. Bec Jasmine ability allows for board control, which none of your other cards provided.

The main weakness of the deck: low HP allies. All the allies HP are 4 and below. A shard rush deck has a higher dmg output but just can't work in the current envt.

It is going to be difficult to make the deck competitive.

[Newari]

Thanks for your thoughts. From my experience playing it so far, I get board control very easily from a fast weenie rush, Jasmines are not necessary though will be going into my 40 card deck. Wyld, Blake, and Aldon mixed with good timing of Lance ability allows me to gain board control early and easily even going second due to lance ability on turns 3 and 4. Assassinate for any troubling fatties that I can't pick down with my swarm. Low hp isn't an issue I find due to ambush with nightshades and lance's ability on blake or aldon. Board control is solidified quickly by turn 3/4.
To counter burn decks I have skullborns to chew up a burn card and leaving my big hitters like blakes/aldons alone. If I'm expecting a board reset ability then I hold back casting more allies and just keep picking away at their hero forcing them to use their board resets. Then I just pounce again with another swarm.

I only need 3 or 4 resources the whole game. That alone means I save cards against almost every other deck trying to get up to 6+ resources. I can afford to lose a wave of weenies and still have cards to bounce right back again with another wave hitting hard.

Somehow my card advantage is staggering due to quick early kills of their allies while I lose none and the added bonus of a cheap resource deck. This all adds up to about 4 or 5 card advantage which is a lot. I'm not sure any creature based deck has a chance against this deck.

I purposely picked low hp low cc creatures with high aggression (wyld/blake). Nightshade is a form of creature control and powered with aldon it gets silly. First attack with nightshade for 2, then follow up with another attack for the knockout blow. If needed lance ability so a blake/aldon can't be attacked back.

[Harakhte]

Truer words, Atomzed, truer words...

As a note, Arcane Burst, Ice Storm, Nova, Tidal Wave, Retreat, Death Mages, Arrows, Nish/Zal/BB SE abilities, Curse, Smite, Special Delivery, Snow Sapphire, Armor of Ages, Voice of Winter... these will make life very difficult for this deck, Ambush/Stealth simply don't spread far enough with only a single card per two turns getting Lance's blessing. In the same sense, as you have no high-cost cards, there will reach a point in each game from T4-6 (when 4+ cc cards begin showing up) that will demonstrate why those particular cards cc is as high as it is and why the resource cost is worth paying. Without Jasmine as suggested above, Stop Thief, a legitimate card draw mechanic, and some heavier allies like Raven or Sandworm, and Lance's best bud Aeon, and Retreat! (it is much more efficient and sheer bluidy useful than Assassinateh a Lance deck will find itself extremely hard pressed against competent opposition to do much beyond scratching the paint before the swing.

I'm not dissing the hard-working and committed men and women making Rogue decks, there is a lot of potential in Lance and Serena, but it will likely be quite sometime before it will be able to be realized. In the meantime try to be as flexible as possible in deck design, as putting all your eggs before the cart of a one-trick pony simply won't work with a non top-tier hero.

Cheers,
- Harakhte

[Newari]

Good points, and I don't pretend to know much. But skullborns helps some against burn. Nightshades at 3 attack are a menace to deal with. And they go through all armor due to being ambush. Simliarily, blakes hitting for 5 can also have ambush from Lance to hit allies/heroes without retribution. I'm not saying this is definitively a Tier1 deck. But follows the principles of highly efficient creatures and can tag team down fatties no problem. The synergy and speed of the deck surprised even me. Trust me, any creatures they put out will be dealt with no problem.

Yes, burn would be an issue and I played against a Nishwan deck and they could only get 1 ability off before I quickly regrouped and swarmed again for the kill. Skullborn helped prevent Arcane Burst from targeting anyone else. No card advantage given. Perhaps a good priest deck would be an issue with ice storms/tidal waves/novas. I can see priests being a major problem.

[CodeDomination]

Check out the rogue decks in my sign for the best rogue decks.

[Newari]

Yes, your cleverly named Crouching Skullborn, Hidden Blake deck is very similar. Do you regard that deck as a high Tier competitive deck?

Main difference I see is the Nightshades instead of Puwen, and Recon instead of BS.
Nightshades are fun to use with ambush/stealth but I can see Puwen's presence being high as well.
The Recon instead of BS is a toss up I guess. I like Recon because it gives more punch without losing card advantage and works well in a weenie deck in beatdown mode.

Are you concerned about lack of item destruction? Stop!Thief seems too expensive too me and not worth the slot.

[danae]

Nightshades at 3 attack are a menace to deal with. And they go through all armor due to being ambush.

As far as I know, ambush only let's you attack without getting any retaliation. Armor will still block what damage it can.

[CodeDomination]

Yes, your cleverly named Crouching Skullborn, Hidden Blake deck is very similar. Do you regard that deck as a high Tier competitive deck?

Main difference I see is the Nightshades instead of Puwen, and Recon instead of BS.
Nightshades are fun to use with ambush/stealth but I can see Puwen's presence being high as well.
The Recon instead of BS is a toss up I guess. I like Recon because it gives more punch without losing card advantage and works well in a weenie deck in beatdown mode.

Are you concerned about lack of item destruction? Stop!Thief seems too expensive too me and not worth the slot.

It is far from top teir, but it is the best rogues get. Believe me i have tried and tried again. Nightshade is pointless in the deck because your allies should be behind a protector. As far as bs vs recon, I find that i have to have the card draw bs has. Before the TO, even with 4x bazaar and 4x bs i could get enough draw. The addition attack is nice, but not worth the loss in cards. Stop Thief is very expansive and i pains me to put it in the deck, but it is required to deal with SS, KP, AoA, etc.

[Newari]

Thanks CodeDomination,
thoughts on that Serena Superdraw deck? Seems too slow to get its combo working and no real threats except what you steal from them.