Close

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 11 to 16 of 16
  1. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    160
    Tournaments Joined
    0
    Tournaments Won
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Kylt View Post
    Can’t you just counter them with other location decks?
    Like I wrote earlier, there is no "meaningful" way of countering those decks apart from 1-2 top level builds. The reason for that is that other counter decks are not strong enough vs random opposition. Something like Ravager Rothem is decent vs Irum but will lose a lot vs other common decks. That is why the meta is so limited atm: The meaningful counters are few, the rest is decks you can play for fun. Having a 55% win rate vs DC or Irum (those 2 deck types are very strong even vs decks crafted to counter them, and it's very difficult to come up with something that has a 60%+ winrate vs them) is not enough to make a deck good. There are some decks that can do that, but fall apart vs most of the "normal" decks common in the meta (stuff like Ele for example).

    The lack of bad MUs and the relatively high win % (40-45) even vs those is what distinguishes Irum and Lakmire from "normal decks". I'm on a 22 win streak with Darkclaw just now, and it's fairly common to win games with draw far from optimal. Same applies to Irum Loest and Aramia, her having seek (seek Distortion Harness->seek Irum), which makes it much easier to recover from a bad initial situation.
    Last edited by Wimbled; 12-27-2020 at 09:16 PM.
    A1: Evolution in Theory

  2. #12
    Senior Member seedog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,262
    Tournaments Joined
    2
    Tournaments Won
    0
    I think altogether location is a problem. That's 2 out of 3 of your OP decks.

    The reason lies with its 0 cost. That's already huge tempo advantage. If it grants other resource renewal that's even broken tempo.

    That's why location are usually either useless (because of bad ability) or broken.

    I think the Design Team can think of a way to incorporate cost to play location. Whether it's by resources or SE or other means, it would help to change the situation.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Kylt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    GMT+9
    Posts
    1,195
    Tournaments Joined
    7
    Tournaments Won
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Wimbled View Post
    Like I wrote earlier, there is no "meaningful" way of countering those decks apart from 1-2 top level builds. The reason for that is that other counter decks are not strong enough vs random opposition. Something like Ravager Rothem is decent vs Irum but will lose a lot vs other common decks. That is why the meta is so limited atm: The meaningful counters are few, the rest is decks you can play for fun. Having a 55% win rate vs DC or Irum (those 2 deck types are very strong even vs decks crafted to counter them, and it's very difficult to come up with something that has a 60%+ winrate vs them) is not enough to make a deck good. There are some decks that can do that, but fall apart vs most of the "normal" decks common in the meta (stuff like Ele for example).

    The lack of bad MUs and the relatively high win % (40-45) even vs those is what distinguishes Irum and Lakmire from "normal decks". I'm on a 22 win streak with Darkclaw just now, and it's fairly common to win games with draw far from optimal. Same applies to Irum Loest and Aramia, her having seek (seek Distortion Harness->seek Irum), which makes it much easier to recover from a bad initial situation.
    Please share the best version of those decklists. Post them on the forum and we'll see if you're right. It's the best way to prove your point and make change happen.
    IGN: Kyltz

  4. #14
    Community Manager SEF Mango's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    The space in between your nightmares
    Posts
    1,008
    Tournaments Joined
    0
    Tournaments Won
    0
    1.1 - Irum simply needs to die. It took a while for people to break this location but it always happens. When you can play 11 resources worth of abilities on 5 total resources, that is an issue that goes beyond ridiculous. On top of that, the Non-Controller ability punishes you for removing it making it actually only valuable for the controller. Especially the fact that it doesn't get exiled, simply shuffled back into the deck.

    Once per turn renewal of 3 resources (basically the same as Lakmire at this point) is more than enough. Still supplies you with 7 resources to spend on 4 resources available. If anyone says that is not enough, well, *shrug*.

    1.2 - I do not see an issue with location or Wulven Prophet. The issue I noticed is the interaction with Wulven Shaman. Yes, Prophet has the same ability that broke General of Unaxio. However, being class specific, I think it's fine that Prophet has a better ability. The change I would like to see is, "When Wulven Prophet is killed, it is exiled." There is no reason to give Wulven access to this strong ability more than 4 times a game.

    Pathfinders Machete - This card needs to be toned down. I never thought I would type the sentence "Darkclaw breaks this card"... What planet is this hahaha. Bottom line though is that this card is just far too good an option. Its text should be in line with Dragon Tooth imo. "Pathfinders Machete's attack can not be increased by hero or ally abilities." Something along those lines. Still buffed when summoned due to location, just not any other means.

    1.3 - What is there that can be done about Victor? As far as I can tell, nothing has really changed from my absence other than Sorcerer of Endia getting buffed. Otherwise, the gameplay and deck build seems pretty much the same. If I am missing something, please tell me. Victor has always had a ton of control options. Gambit, Traps, Hero ability all give Victor great tools to control the board. If nothing else, perhaps we can also have Trapper be exiled upon death? Perhaps the seek option on a 2cc card is just far too strong to leave it in the game for a possible second time use from the grave. Maybe every card made in this mold should have the same exile on death condition much like how seek transformed into a 2SE universal cost.

    2.1 - I do not believe in giving Zaladar and Ythan a better way to deal with Elementalis. Elementalis has always been the bane for Zaladar. I enjoy that in this game there are some matchups that you are likely just not going to win. Some people do not like the "rock paper scissors" but that's just balance. Its the risk you take playing any deck. You build it to win as much as possible knowing that certain decks will likely take you down.

    2.2 - A one time per turn heal of 2 does not seem too devastating on paper but dam... it is a pain. I honestly do not know how or if this needs a change. Even Zhanna does not use her ability often to heal so I do not think that is part of the argument. Perhaps have the heal have a limitation in regards to stored SE? "Once per turn when Crimson Knight takes damage and your hero has 3 or more SE, your hero heals 2 damage." Only issue is I do not really want to tone it down because it is a class specific card and they should be stronger than those that are not. The issue here though is that with Devoted Knight to speed up your resource curve, it may have to be toned down. So in the end... I have no idea what to do lol

    2.3 - I have always thought that Dhalia Blackrose was an issue. Haste is an ability that is game changing ESPECIALLY when teamed up with stealth. Giving Lance an option to bypass the few cards that actually stop haste has always seemed like an issue. Should a hero ability be so greatly hampered by an ally? Maybe not. However, with other great options such as retreat and operative, I see no reason why Dhalia is needed to clear 5cc allies.

    2.4 - Squire is strong... I think I am ok with it staying as is though. I am on the fence. 4 health on a 2cc is always a tipping point especially since the only downside is that it has no attack on your opponents turn. Sorcerer though... This guy has been an issue in the game for years. Either way too good or such garbage you wonder why you even have any copies in your collection. The ability is very punishing but I do enjoy there being a card that can turn the tables on high ability/item usage decks. There needs to be some checking of those decks. I suppose -1 health is the first option. 2/5 is decent for a 4cc. The utility it provides should make it easier to remove at the same time.

    Anyways... off to celebrate New Years! Cheers everyone~
    "Is he a man? Or, is he a mango?" - Gondorian

    Host of 130 Pop up Tournaments. 520 free packs awarded!


    Join our Telegram Community. This link will take you to the welcome room. We use it to filter out trolls and bots.Telegram

    Check out and please subscribe to my Shadow Era accounts:

    Join Shadow Era on Social Media: Facebook|Twitter

  5. #15
    Senior Member Nijjis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    382
    Tournaments Joined
    0
    Tournaments Won
    0
    I think prophet getting exiled on death might be a sufficient nerf, or at least a good first course of action. Iirc I too suggested this nerf on tele a month or so ago.

  6. #16
    Community Manager SEF Mango's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    The space in between your nightmares
    Posts
    1,008
    Tournaments Joined
    0
    Tournaments Won
    0
    I wasn’t around then so I’m claiming the idea as my own! Lol
    "Is he a man? Or, is he a mango?" - Gondorian

    Host of 130 Pop up Tournaments. 520 free packs awarded!


    Join our Telegram Community. This link will take you to the welcome room. We use it to filter out trolls and bots.Telegram

    Check out and please subscribe to my Shadow Era accounts:

    Join Shadow Era on Social Media: Facebook|Twitter

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •