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  1. #51
    Devoted Fan Gondorian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlastMan View Post
    so you just ignore the costs that it takes to recycle. to me, 4se and 3cc and the use of a card is more than fair to kill an ally and draw 2 cards.
    But the card you use was retrieved with the 4SE. So the true cost is 4SE and 3cc only. You can then kill off an ally of any size/health directly and draw two cards into hand.

    And the 3cc cost was often reduced to 1cc thanks to Zailen Crusader. And the resources were often negligible because you kept creating more with Anmor's Call. So actually it was pretty much just 4SE. You think that is a fair cost? Majiya does 3 fire damage to an ally (which can be reduced by ally abilities or attachments or even traps like Decoy Trap or blocked completely) and then draws 1 card for 4SE. Boris can kill an ally of 4cc or lower but gets no card draw. Loest can exile any card for 5SE but does not draw any cards.

    Maybe you just disagree that draw is king in this game?

  2. #52
    Devoted Fan Gondorian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlastMan View Post
    so you just ignore the costs that it takes to recycle. to me, 4se and 3cc and the use of a card is more than fair to kill an ally and draw 2 cards.



    most of us know that playing BF on turn 3 is the worst play to make, doing it only when its the only turn 3 play you have.

    also you are using shadow warriors as a comparison who are just weak to begin with. regardless of what gambit can do. using nearly any other hero to compare to bane and bad would of shown this whole scenario to be much better than you are portraying it. all this shows is that shadow warriors need help and a lot of it. .
    I'm sorry, there were comments somewhere (Telegram?) stating to play Blood Frenzy once on T3 and draw one card all game as though that means Hunter's Gambit needs to be so very strong too. If you delay playing BF, then there are fewer turns of benefit, which renders the argument that Hunter's Gambit is poor by comparison to BF much weaker.

    What you are saying actually proved my point more. If you wait to play BF then the Hunter player got their extra cards already and has seen more cards already and you haven't. I don't see how Shadow Warriors are relevant. I picked the most offensive ally to give to the Warrior player in an attempt to achieve board control (Feasterling) whilst still drawing their cards. Using Human Warriors, you have even lower chance of drawing cards and having the board because they don't have the 3-attack ally and can't play Aldon/War Banner on T3 because they played BF to get the most draw from it over the course of the game.

    I'm fairly sure a lot of warriors do play T3 Blood Frenzy though. Would have to ask them or have them see this and comment, but we are digressing a bit.

  3. #53
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    "So the true cost is 4SE and 3cc only" even looking at it like that, its still a fair cost to kill an ally and draw 2 cards. 7 TOTAL resources.

    as for zailen, thats a whole other card with another 3cc and one that has a target on its head the moment you put it out. it doesnt last long but you could cast it the turn you get a gambit back and then use that gambit, thats a good play. still requires 4se and 4cc and 2 cards to pull off. why is that bad?

    as for anmor, is that the real reason you nerfed gambit in the first place? cause that is a very very bad reason to nerf gambit. gambit was just one of several ways to get cards in that deck. it was the piling up of resources that was the problem. as long as it didnt lose early, you were gonna win no matter what. no one could deal with all those resources and dropping a ton of cards. taking gambit recycling away didnt change that. it didnt change other hunters, as they couldnt recycle it anyway but it really hurt smaller vic decks. they need that recycling. victor sucked before gambit. now he is close to that again.

    majiya's ability is crap or she would be out there more. boris is pretty good and he is a decent hero to play but lacks a lot of things being a warrior cause you are too worried about op'ing amber. he is a lot better than logan, mainly because he is human and way way better than ter adun. and they will stay that way, against because of amber. loest is pretty expensive but can be useful. the best thing about it, is you can run without item and ability destruction and be ok.



    and no, i agree draw is king in this game. doesnt mean you should take it away. it means there should be more for those that lack it. nerfing a draw card nerfs those heroes who could use it and the ones that are still lacking, still lack it. also, there are a ton of draw cards in the game, some great, most are crap. and a lot of that crap was because of nerfing. every hero needs good draw or they are crap. only two ways to fix that, let every hero have good draw or let no one have good draw.

    and here comes a very personal opinion. i think BF is crap now. i dont think its that good. it was but after others got better draw, its mediocre. you have to wait till turn 5 or later to cast it and now that games are taking longer, going more turns, that damage is now a huge hindrance. the best draw in the game now, i think, is sosilo, with possibly chalice being second (sorting and picking the best of 3, is hugely powerful). i would still say that even if you remove exile from gambit.
    Last edited by BlastMan; 11-16-2017 at 02:33 PM.

  4. #54
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    How about this then:

    Hunter's Gambit. 2cc. Attach to target opposing ally. That ally has -1 health. When Hunter's Gambit is destroyed, draw 1 card. If the ally is killed in combat, draw 1 additional card and Hunter's Gambit is exiled.

    What benefits come from this:
    1. itīs flavorwise (if you go kill the prey youīre hunting you get an additional reward), similar to Pride of the Mountain.
    2. Heroes other than Victor can get the original draw benefit, if they struggle for it.
    3. Victor can still use it in combo with his ability for constant renewal (one of itīs biggest strength) but without the superdraw. If he needs a draw engine, he must look for something else.

  5. #55
    Devoted Fan Gondorian's Avatar
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    Hunters gambit change

    Quote Originally Posted by Nik View Post
    How about this then:

    Hunter's Gambit. 2cc. Attach to target opposing ally. That ally has -1 health. When Hunter's Gambit is destroyed, draw 1 card. If the ally is killed in combat, draw 1 additional card and Hunter's Gambit is exiled.

    What benefits come from this:
    1. itīs flavorwise (if you go kill the prey youīre hunting you get an additional reward), similar to Pride of the Mountain.
    2. Heroes other than Victor can get the original draw benefit, if they struggle for it.
    3. Victor can still use it in combo with his ability for constant renewal (one of itīs biggest strength) but without the superdraw. If he needs a draw engine, he must look for something else.
    That's the kind of thing. Might not be THE one, but nice to see another variant being pitched. Thanks.

  6. #56
    Senior Member Jao's Avatar
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    Gambit is the best thing that's happened to Hunters. before it, Shadow Hunters sucked and the only playable Hunter was Gwen and Victor. I'm not really for changes limiting variety.

    idk why we're focusing on this card when there are other heroes that really need help. can we stop with the nerfs and start with the boosts? please give some help to the most underused heroes in SE.
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  7. #57
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    I don't see why people think that Victor got "destroyed" by the HG change. He's still a tier 2 hero. Instead of arguing why he should be made tier 1 again why don't we use that energy to buff the worst heroes, tier 3 and tier 4. One reason why they are so bad off is that their cards suck, another reason is that some other factions/heroes are too strong.

    I would like to see this game in a more balanced state to enhance variety, which can be achieved by various means. It would do good for this game and make it more interesting. Hunters are arguably the best class, they have 3 heroes that are tier 1 (Badu, BB, Ythan) and 3 heroes that are tier 2 (Vox, Gwen, Vic). Still people think that gambit nerf and shuri nerf were the worst decisions ever... I think that they just don't see the whole picture. Problem is hunters having tier 2 heroes, not that heroes like Ter, Logan and Rothem are T4? I don't agree with this "logic".

  8. #58
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    Bad idea, I consider it a huge step back. (and it actually is). This will make hunter's odds vs warriors even less than they are now. 2 cards draw is the perfect spot imho, compared to IGG and blood frenzy it's still not as much. About Bobcat - most people use PAE to haste it, so this gambit change won't affect this ally much. Karash's still very playable, especially with new upcoming cards. Making gambit 2cc -1 health just because of that is truly ridiculous..

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by a1umba View Post
    Bad idea, I consider it a huge step back. (and it actually is). This will make hunter's odds vs warriors even less than they are now. 2 cards draw is the perfect spot imho, compared to IGG and blood frenzy it's still not as much. About Bobcat - most people use PAE to haste it, so this gambit change won't affect this ally much. Karash's still very playable, especially with new upcoming cards. Making gambit 2cc -1 health just because of that is truly ridiculous..
    Igg and bf represent a significant tempo loss and can be easily broken (which often f's you) so the comparison is not so good imo. They can't be seeked with general on summon either.

  10. #60
    Community Manager SEF Mango's Avatar
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    I saw a comment (checked and it was Nijjis idea) made about this and decided to resurrect the thread... lol... after I left Gondo to clean up the mess I created.

    So, keep the card as it is in regards to cost and card draw. Maybe make it -1 health. I mean, it already gives you 2 cards for 3 cost.

    Anyhow, the comment was:

    If hunters gambit was not played the turn it was removed from a graveyard, it is exiled.

    So, it gives you the ability to recycle it but you have to use it the turn it was brought back from grave. Otherwise, it is exiled from you hand at the end of your turn.

    His idea made me think of this one:

    When hunters gambit is destroyed, it is exiled. If a hero activated their ability the turn it is destroyed, it is sent to graveyard instead. .

    Wording needs a ton of help but the idea is that if Victor utilized his hero ability then used gambit and it is destroyed, that it will go to the grave allowing for recycling. So, if you use it without activating your shadow ability, it is exiled.
    Last edited by SEF Mango; 02-03-2018 at 11:22 AM.
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