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  1. #1
    Senior Member BlackAngel's Avatar
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    What advice would you give new players on deck building?

    Making video tutorials (they will have write ups to go along with them) on deck building for beginners. It is targeted towards new players that understand how the game is played but is either inexperienced or completely new to deck crafting. I've been out of the game for awhile and everyone's experiences are different so I am asking the community for help. What advice would you give new players on deck building?

    Please do not add things like "have fun" or "whatever is favorable in the meta." These are obvious but do not make you any better.

    Appreciate your guys help
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  2. #2
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    I would tell them to use a deck that is proven here is why

    1. You are new
    2. You don't know the heroes
    3. You don't know the cards
    4. You don't know which cards interacted with which heroes and how well they do
    5. Focus on learning how to play
    6. Deck building should be the last thing you learn
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  3. #3
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    The first thing a new player should do, before anything, is reading theory articles. Such as what's an aggro deck, a control deck, a mill deck, a resource curve, so on and so forth. I, personally, do recommend MtG articles simply because the game is older, more well-established, has more players, more theorists, and thus simply more resources. Give preference to Shadow Era articles since this game does have some subtleties (the way the resource pile works, Shadow Energy and Hero Powers), but reading some classic MtG articles, such as Who's the Beatdown, should be mandatory. That being said...

    The very basic start for deckbuilding is simple top-down design, AKA this card is really cool and can be very strong if supported well (a certain hero, ally, weapon, synergy, whatever), let's try to maximize this. Say, Vess Swifthands looks like can do a lot of degenerate things with his power, let's build a deck around that, with attachments and cards that care about attachments. A very important thing at this stage is to try and streamline the deck as much as possible. You have one goal and you don't deviate from it. If a certain card is not either directly contributing to the goal, or not being a hoser to something that directly and explicitly counters your goal, you cut it.

    Netdecking is important in the sense that new players often can't find the strong synergies and build-around cards right from the get-go. So, by netdecking, you get a head start having a deck that's already been tested and trimmed down. You can, then, study it. Why did that person picked X card in Y amount? In what situations it is good? Bad? When should I throw it in the resource pile? What's the best case use for this card? In what spot in my curve does it fit? If you can analyze a deck like that, you can then evaluate your own decks. Be very critical, if an idea is bad, it is bad, doesn't matter if it's your pet idea or whatever. Be direct and level-headed.

    A very important concept for a player is probabilities. What's the best size for a deck (protip: usually the minimum allowed)? What's the probability of a Warrior drawing one of the four copies of Blood Frenzy turn 3 on a 39-card deck? A 49-card deck? A 59-card deck? Or, if you have 7 draw engines, what's the chance of drawing one of them? Both? Should you use cards like Bad Santa or Glimmer of Hope to increase the chance to find them? To how much would the percentage jump to? In a spot where you have to draw a specific card or you lose, what's the chance of you drawing it (in Poker, this is known as your "out"). There are some articles out there that talk about it.

    Another option for deckbuilding is seeing what's an empty spot in the current metagame, what are its weaknesses, and then building a deck that can exploit it. Say, if most decks are weak to weapons, you can abuse someone like Amber. If decks are greedy with their resource curves and can't play a low economy game, some sort of resource denial deck might be a good move. This is harder and comes with experience but it's the next level for deckbuilding.

    Yeah, there are lots of things, these are just some of them. But I believe the best way to improve in ANY game (Shadow Era, Counter-Strike, Chess, you name it) is theorycrafting, researching and high-level gameplay analysis. If you know how to search for things, how to absorb them, and how to evaluate decisions, all the other things will come with time.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Kylt's Avatar
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    To think about t1-5 play.

    It doesn't matter if the t1-5 play you come up with beats opponent t1-5, or if it actually works. Thinking about your own t1-5 is the most important part. By thinking about your early game, you must think about cc curve as well as connecting different cards and card interaction, and it teaches you how many copies to run, etc. At the beginning you don't know the right t1-5 play but it's ok because you'll learn it if you always have that in mind.

    Honestly this is all you need to know in deckbuilding in shadow era, even at the highest level.

  5. #5
    Senior Member BlackAngel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nam31355man View Post
    I would tell them to use a deck that is proven here is why

    1. You are new
    2. You don't know the heroes
    3. You don't know the cards
    4. You don't know which cards interacted with which heroes and how well they do
    5. Focus on learning how to play
    6. Deck building should be the last thing you learn
    That's very insightful and would be an extremely informative video. Deck crafting for beginners "don't deck craft."

    I understand where you are coming from but out of the hundreds of decks being posted on the forums you can't say all of them are successful or put together by an experienced player of the game. How can a new player tell what decks are good and what are bad? They must understand the principles that go behind creating a deck.

    Some people also only get enjoyment creating decks and not playing competitively or using decks other made. So therefore a tutorial would be very useful for those individuals to at least get them started in the right direction.
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  6. #6
    Devoted Fan Gondorian's Avatar
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    I'd say start by deciding how you are going to win and put in the cards that you think will do some damage to opposing hero. Think about what would be your ideal play if opponent did nothing for 5 turns and get those cards in your deck. All those are your THREATS.

    After that, you should think about what cards you might need to protect your own hero or your own threats. These are your ANSWERS.

    Sometimes a card can be a threat and an answer. If you find such a card then it can perform double-duty for you. Allies with on-summon abilities usually qualify as a threat and answer.

    I'd definitely put all that in a beginner deckbuilding article.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Daemon Rayge's Avatar
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    The first and foremost, and most important factor when building any Deck. What is your win condition? That is, how exactly do you plan to win? Constantly trading your opponent until they're out of answers to your threats? Maybe overwhelming them with a large number of allies? Or perhaps you plan on winning by emptying the opponent's Deck out completely.

    Whatever it is, your Deck must be built with that win condition in mind. Some Decks, not all, can also be built with a fallback win condition if the primary one should fail or you don't draw the cards for it. As long as the cards you plan on using can be used as part of both methods, then you should be good.
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  8. #8
    Senior Member Nijjis's Avatar
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    A few things some of which have already been mentioned.. Card probability factor in the size of your deck and make sure your resource curve (the right amount of t2, t3 cards etc) is well balanced. Starting with the basics.. In a 40 card deck I'm typically running 6-8 card draws, 4-6 2cc allies 7-10 3cc allies and that's my main priority. After that's covered you want to consider things like: do I need item removal? If you do generally 2-4 will suffice.

    If I'm playing a 60 card deck I'm generally going to want 6-8 t2 cards 4 of which should atleast be allies, and 10-12 t3 allies. The bigger the deck a higher % of card draws is usually good because you will suffer from more inconsistency. So instead 12 card draws I might got for 13-14.

    Include cards that are unconditionally strong (Think infernal gargoyle). Cards that are reliant on specific situations and interactions while sometimes are strongest are at other times cards that will sit in your hand unplayed or will be sacrificed. As a good rule of thumb you want as few of these as possible and the larger your deck size the less desirable these cards become.

    Knowing when to hold em and when to fold em / when to play em when to stay em: One of the biggest mistakes I see in less experienced players is being in a rush to sacrifice and or to play too many cards. You don't always need to sacrifice or play a card even on t4. If you feel like you have a game well in hand and you are in the driver seat you may not want to rush for the win (unless you feel like you need to rush it). Slow down, sacrifice less cards, play less cards if you have solid board control.

  9. #9
    DP Visionary Shadows R Us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackAngel View Post
    That's very insightful and would be an extremely informative video. Deck crafting for beginners "don't deck craft."

    I understand where you are coming from but out of the hundreds of decks being posted on the forums you can't say all of them are successful or put together by an experienced player of the game. How can a new player tell what decks are good and what are bad? They must understand the principles that go behind creating a deck.

    Some people also only get enjoyment creating decks and not playing competitively or using decks other made. So therefore a tutorial would be very useful for those individuals to at least get them started in the right direction.
    Look for two things.

    Rating they say they played the deck at. Anything over 300 is a great start.

    Was this posted recently. More importantly have there been major changes to the game since the deck was posted. You want something currentish.
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  10. #10
    Senior Member Nijjis's Avatar
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    ^^^^^ this. I was just about to make an edit on my post saying that any players who are interested in getting better should watch as many of the top players games as possible. Studying combined with lots of practice will help you learn what's good and what is isn't. Improved decision making will only come when you put in the time. You need to learn from your mistakes. Learning how to build a good deck, learning what to play / sac and when to do it.. These skills take quite a while to develop. A new player could copy exactly a top players deck but may never be able to reach the same level of proficiency.

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