Close

Page 2 of 12 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 120

Thread: Mulligans

  1. #11
    DP Visionary FDL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    4,188
    Tournaments Joined
    3
    Tournaments Won
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Veles View Post
    I am really not for it. Most requests I feel come from rush players. This would just make those decks more consistent, which would lead to more people playing them, which would lead to boring QM and NPE. Ofc you can argue that it helps other player find answer to rush, but in practice those answer are fewer than cards opponent uses to rush because he build his deck for it.
    I'm not so sure rush decks will benefit that much. If you mulligan and play on turns 1 to 3, you have one card left in hand. It better be a good one.

    Bad Santa is popular in rush and would help mitigate the card loss but playing T2 BS doesn't put a lot of pressure on your opponent...

    Actually, stall decks that run a lot of Bad Santa or Bazaar might get the most benefits from this. Finding draw and/or Evil Ascendant is super important for them.
    FDL TV!

    Channel | Thread | Twitter
    Deck Techs, Game Commentary, Replay Analysis and more!

    FDL Tips: The Metagame, Balance and You || Empty Hands
    LL Decklists: Serena || Elementalis

  2. #12
    DP Visionary Shadow Mann's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    North Carolina, USA
    Posts
    1,874
    Tournaments Joined
    5
    Tournaments Won
    1
    [QUOTE=Gondorian;497541]Whilst simple to implement, this WILL affect balance and the meta.

    I think if you're going to bring this in, then you should also increase the minimum deck size to 50. Otherwise, it improves consistency too much and throws off the balance. With an increased minimum and a mulligan then you will both help and hinder consistency, at the same time increasing variety and reducing the probability of clumping.

    This is my feeling as well...either keep the game the way it is with no mulligan, or add a mulligan option while also increase min deck size.
    Avenger of Valhalla
    Warriors of the Blue Phoenix
    Greatness, Reborn

  3. #13
    DP Visionary FDL's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    4,188
    Tournaments Joined
    3
    Tournaments Won
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Gondorian View Post
    Whilst simple to implement, this WILL affect balance and the meta.

    I think if you're going to bring this in, then you should also increase the minimum deck size to 50. Otherwise, it improves consistency too much and throws off the balance. With an increased minimum and a mulligan then you will both help and hinder consistency, at the same time increasing variety and reducing the probability of clumping.

    How about we do a PUBLIC TEST with Mulligan and 50-card minimum together? Just have it as an option in Custom Match. The community will give feedback and we go from there.
    Testing would be the only way to know, but since we're theorycrafting, here are my 2 cents:

    Mulliganing (with a card penalty) would be terrible for most decks in most games (but hey, it can give you the illusion you're in the game after one of the rare SE terrible starting hand ).

    Going to 50 cards would be terrible for all decks expect midrange decks.
    FDL TV!

    Channel | Thread | Twitter
    Deck Techs, Game Commentary, Replay Analysis and more!

    FDL Tips: The Metagame, Balance and You || Empty Hands
    LL Decklists: Serena || Elementalis

  4. #14
    Senior Member Lightning Fury's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Where assassins go
    Posts
    2,561
    Tournaments Joined
    3
    Tournaments Won
    0
    Mulligans are a great way to improve consistency in nearly every deck out there with 40 cards. I would want my opponent to use it every time. He loses a card and I get another added advantage to seize control of the board.
    “Let the wilds temper you, and if you weather it, in time the prodigal will return, a viper to his master’s bosom. Pawn takes king.”

    Lightning Fury
    The Mourning Tactician of Akallabęth
    Warrior of The Blue Phoenix
    Greatness, Reborn


    IGN|BP LightningFury
    WotBP Trophy Room|Achievements
    Guild Leader


    Articles

  5. #15
    Senior Member Unruler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    5,299
    Tournaments Joined
    0
    Tournaments Won
    0
    Blog Entries
    1
    Mulligan is necessary because of 4x of a card is available to be put in a deck, you may draw 3-4 of them in your starting hand, also in 40 card deck it's hard to fish for the card and if you got a bad draw, you're most likely going to lose.

    But the way Kyle wants to implement it is poor, you're creating useless mechanic only few people will use, so what's the point to put it in at all? That would be another Word of the Prophet. Disadvantage of loosing a card is pretty huge especially considering that you need sacrifice for resources and having less cards may prevent you from playing those cards, so it's very bad, and while having bad hand, choosing a mulligan may be a no-win situation.

    It's also imbalanced because second player mulligans while at more cards, so he has a chance to mulligan more efficiently AND he sees first opponent's play so he can have an idea about what type of deck his opponent is playing.

    So, only way of player losing cards in mulligan should be if they choose to mulligan second time. It's ok to have one free mulligan especially if you shuffle your whole hand, you may end up drawing even worse one. It may even be fine to use selective mulligan, like in Hearthstone.

    PS Actually, it's the decks with high cost cards that benefit from mulligan the most because if you end up with a lot of high cost cards in your starting hand, you're lost, and rush decks don't care all that much since whole their deck is cheap cards, they would have early game regardless of draw. It's also beneficial to combo decks but those aren't spread in SE.
    Scrupulous Ash Collector of the Blue Phoenix.
    Warriors of the Blue Phoenix

    Greatness, Reborn

    Shadow Era Network - Shadow Era community hub.

    Quote Originally Posted by BDK16 View Post
    You're the best Unruler!
    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Bhleg View Post
    No one know FS better than you, our King of FS.

  6. #16
    Senior Member Pandevmonium's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Latina, Italy
    Posts
    1,994
    Tournaments Joined
    7
    Tournaments Won
    0
    I always face Blood Frenzy -> Jeweler's Dream + CB with Amber or Kris -> Puwen -> PotL -> Aldon from well tuned decks, so I don't think mulligan is a serious feature for this game right now.

  7. #17
    1.27 Tournament Champion Raphael Majere's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    8,540
    Tournaments Joined
    4
    Tournaments Won
    0
    Blog Entries
    6
    Quote Originally Posted by Lightning Fury View Post
    Mulligans are a great way to improve consistency in nearly every deck out there with 40 cards. I would want my opponent to use it every time. He loses a card and I get another added advantage to seize control of the board.
    This is presuming that aramia / other rush deck are affected by the minus 1 card. If they run with a lot of draw like 4 bs and more, and that the penalty is negligible or manageable, these rush decks might rule the QM. Likewise, as fdl said, similar to the stall/lock decks. Increasing the minimum deck size would aid these stall decks more too. The mulligan needs to be tested to see it's impact in QM.

    About me: An Interview
    About my guild: Warriors of the Blue Phoenix

  8. #18
    DP Visionary raizoir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    45
    Tournaments Joined
    0
    Tournaments Won
    0
    If this game was like mtg with lands, then I would say absolutely.

    Now for it to be introduced in the game the way it currently is, even with the loss of a card, I would argue that it would simply result in the game being dumbed-down in a sense. There are just too many games that play themselves now and the level of risk in getting a bad opening hand in order to achieve certain plays is just something you should be considering when creating your deck. I therefore consider a mulligan not being offered in this game as a benefit, as otherwise you might as well have a card game which has two AIs pitted against each other, with each always drawing and playing the optimal card.

    Another knock-on effect to consider would be that people will be expecting the perfect hand more so than before, especially after a mulligan, which could lead to more rage quits if their expectations are not met. Instead, people should have a plan of what to do with a less than optimal opening hand if their opponent is X and does Y.

  9. #19
    Senior Member Ness's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    727
    Tournaments Joined
    0
    Tournaments Won
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Gondorian View Post
    Whilst simple to implement, this WILL affect balance and the meta.

    I think if you're going to bring this in, then you should also increase the minimum deck size to 50. Otherwise, it improves consistency too much and throws off the balance. With an increased minimum and a mulligan then you will both help and hinder consistency, at the same time increasing variety and reducing the probability of clumping.

    How about we do a PUBLIC TEST with Mulligan and 50-card minimum together? Just have it as an option in Custom Match. The community will give feedback and we go from there.
    I am all for increasing the minimum deck size!
    However, I am against implementing mulligan.
    PK Love

  10. #20
    Senior Member Vyz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    319
    Tournaments Joined
    30
    Tournaments Won
    8
    Mulligan should be here. I don't see any disadvantage to it and the potential benefits are huge (might make combo and control decks possible). Just make it free, the 1 card penalty right away is unnecessary. Increasing deck minimum to 50 is a terrible idea aswell. Also the notion that mulligan helps rush decks more than other decks is ridiculous, dunno what you people are smoking.
    Last edited by Vyz; 06-17-2014 at 12:48 PM.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •