This is how I think Priests should be, developers.

[Lone Wulevn]

First,

I would like to say that I, myself, do not play a Priest deck, But the fact that their shadow abilities require immediate attention is too obvious to ignore.

So here we go.

Zhanna Mist:

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Why should this be implemented?:
"Isn't it like the healing counterpart of Malijya but with less cost? That seems unfair."

Is what you might think. But hear me out. First, yes it is like our busty Mage's ability but it is definitely not unfair. Take 2 opposing allies with 3 attack and 4 health (standard average of cost 3 allies), backed up by our respective ladies. Now if they were to combat, Majiya would be able to kill the opposing ally with her shadow ability in one turn and draw a card. However, Zhanna -would not be able to, as healing cannot be done before the damage. Even if she started her turn first.

This put her shadow ability at a great disadvantage. Healing is already by itself, lackluster in this game. Which is why in the first place, her original shadow ability was in need of change. And which is why now, having a cost of 3 should not be seen as an unfair advantage. Even if it can be used on her hero because -as I have said, healing by itself is too big a disadvantage. It's only right that we give this ability some sort boost to offset the horrible nature of this shadow ability. And only 3 health? C'mon, we can definitely do better than that.

Jericho Spellbane:

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"Target friendly hero or ally has all enemy attachments and negative effects removed, or target attachment is removed. If the attachment was attached to an enemy hero or ally, it takes 3 arcane damage. If the attachment was attached to a friendly hero or ally, it heals for 3 damage."

Why should this be implemented?

His ability is situational at best. Now, we can build a deck out of allies but we cannot build a deck out of attachments. This is a fact no one can deny. Thus, at the cost of 4, this Priest can deal with the occasional attachment that comes his way. However, at a high cost of 4 shadow energy, that does not deal with anything else BUT attachments and the occasional negative effect. This shadow ability leaves a player wanting more.

As I said, it is situational, very situational -that his shadow ability might ever come into use. If you play anything other than pure attachments in your deck, he is already in trouble because as long as you put something else down, his shadow ability is wasted. And the fact that 90% of the attachments out there actually cost less than his shadow ability (shadow energy, which is only recharged ONCE per round) is yet another reason why this improvement should exist.

Greater specialization should beget greater effect. This is the rule of card games. Something as specialized as this Cleric's ability deserves to have something more when he finally gets to use it, the 3 arcane damage/healing is only the rightful bonus he deserves.

[tman507]

First of all, welcome to the forums.

Unfortunately, any changes to these cards are not going to happen, as all cards from the first and second sets are now finalized and set in stone. Not particularly sure why these changes are particularly necessary anyway. Zhanna's ability being less than Majiya's makes sense because Zhanna's doesn't draw a card, Majiya costs 4SE for the draw to be included. Plus Zhanna does just fine anyway, she was used by iClipse to win the 2012 World Championship. Jericho's ability is situational for sure, but can give some decks a real hard time (I know as a primarily Warrior player). Also, the ability of him dealing damage or healing from destroying attachments can be done by future cards in new expansions. Plus changing his ability like that would make his text ridiculously small and hard to read, lol. Not saying these are bad ideas necessarily, just are never going to happen.

[Wes Davis]

Yeah, it's not like they are underpowered now though. With their card pool you really can't give Priests abilities on par with Mayija for instance.

I am looking forward to the new set and a new Priest or two to choose from. Perhaps we get one that has a little more useful ability.

Lets make some guesses as to the new Priest ability.

I'll say 4SE: return target ally in your graveyard to your hand. Sort of like a less resource efficient gravebone. (but a gravebone that gets to take advantage of on summon abilities)

Or maybe

4SE: Holy Shield effect

Or maybe

3SE: Target friendly ally gains +1/+1 and Steadfast

[Jo3yb0i]

Like most people will say, these cards are already set in stone. However, future sets may have cards that will help improve these heroes abilities. For all we know, Elementalis will be the hero of our next WC champion

[tman507]

For all we know, Elementalis will be the hero of our next WC champion

Or maybe even Logan *gasp*

[Lone Wulevn]

Yeah, it's not like they are underpowered now though. With their card pool you really can't give Priests abilities on par with Mayija for instance.

They ARE underpowered. That is why my thread exists. So much so that even I, who does not play a Priest, feels bad for the Priests I go up against. Because I, their enemy, sees how bad their abilities are and how useless it is against my average deck.

Actually, Priest card pool is horrible. I play a Wulven deck and Mage deck while my friend plays a trap Hunter deck and Elementalist deck and we can all agree. Priest card pool does not make up for their crappy abilities, at all.

Even if they weren't horrible. If by your saying that the card pool should affect a hero's shadow ability, then warriors should have the worst abilities of them all. Given that they have equipments that deal with ALL situations and some of the most cost efficient control cards in the game (see Crippling Blow and Smashing). But yet, they have some of the most effective shadow abilities? +2 attack to a weapon at the mere cost of 3? Remove an ally as long as it's cost is less than 4? I say nay, that logic behind your reason is flawed. If irregularities such as warriors exist then I see no reason why Priests should be hindered by their already measly card pool.


As I said, the nature of healing is bad in this game. Unlike hearthstone where there is no constant first strike mechanic (damage there is done simultaneous, not sequential), this game does. That's why healing is well-done there but not here. You cannot use healing as an offensive stratergy in the same turn here. 4 SE instead of 3 SE is to costly for a defensive ability, if defensive abilities are to cost as much as offensive abilities then they better have much larger effects. OR, have a much lower cost.


I can see your point in the Holy Shield effect but as for your other effect, no. +1/+1 and steadfast isn't going to help anyone. But then again, the holy shield effect means further styming Priests into playing ally based decks. Which is a bad thing to hamper a player's creativity. If you have know what I mean.




ALSO: (Warning, explanation of some fundamentals of various cards games incoming. Cover your eyes if you wish to remain pure and untouched by anyone except shadowera.)


No, first print does not mean the cards are set in stone. All card games, online or not, have errata and ban lists. They exist for this reason. And first print cards are usually the ones that get banned then renovated. I've played alot of card games and I don't see any logical reason why having physical cards means they are set in stone.

Example: Yugioh had Raigeki as one of their first cards and everyone had them, Raigeki was banned in the first half-year it came out. 1 year later Raigeki was reprinted with a new effect and called a new name, Lightning Vortex. Now Raigeki cannot be used in tournaments as of yet BUT Raigeki is still selling much as a collectible physical card for a whopping $25 because it is out of print. Lightning Vortex is bought as well. And yugioh is still a popular card game.

Same with Necropotence (the long-term equivalent of Blood Frenzy here) with MTG, same with the old Gold Paladin Twin Drive effect from Vanguard. They were banned. Ban lists and changes exist, they move card games forward. If nothing can be done about Priests to improve them just because their physical cards exist somewhere like you think, then this game is stagnant, this game is already dead before you know it. Simply because it can never correct itself. Not correcting itself is the reason why duel msters died and how pokemon TCG remains rather uncompetitive despite it's starting success, you have pokemon, we all have pokemon ...but now do you still constantly buy pokemon?

TCGs with ban-lists, or improve on their already printed cards with newer versions, have added value, because once a card is banned and/or out of print, it starts becoming rare. And valuable, encouraging the collectible aspect in Trading card game. Unless shadowera purposely intends to miss out on this added value just because it stubbornly does not want to change the Priests, I don't see why they cannot change it.


*Trivia: banning old cards does not mean it was done because the card led to ridiculous exploitation, it is ALSO done when cards have newer, better versions of themselves with the same name. The design team simply needed to use the old name with new effects and players rarely complain.

Now that I have explained why changes can be made, even with physical cards out (unless shadowera wants to start it's floundering here), the first changes should be to balance the game. And that being said, why not start with Priests?

[Jo3yb0i]

I understand not all cards are set in stone. And that in the future it may change. I mean amber, Gwen, Elementalis, baduruu, and practically more half of current heroes had different abilities before. But based on what Wulven stated in the past, they are unlikely to change cards once physical version is printed. But this doesn't mean that they won't ban cards in the future if they find them to be too strong. That is what happened with yugioh. They made really strong cards in the beginning sets and now that their card pool grown extensively, they were forced to ban cards and put limitations. whose to say SE will not do that once we have a card pool of around 3000 cards. But those decisions will be discussed by Wulven in due time.

[Lone Wulevn]

Well, I certainly hope they do make those changes and soon. This card game is still relatively fragile, imbalances like these can really kill it's playerbase once veterans start telling the newcomers about it. Newcomers mostly want to play a card game to express their styles, if they find out their style is not viable in the game then they won't want to stay. It's a fact.

I simply want Wulven games to remember that Priests make up 1/6 of the classes. It is not something to be ignored.

However unlike yugioh, whose player base realized it's mistakes (cards that are imbalancedly useless and/or require considerable nerfing like Necropotence *ahem* Blood frenzy) after many expansions. Shadowera made such mistakes during it's first two expansions.

It was the playerbase which pointed that out AND it was to the success of the TCGs that they heeded those player's opinions quickly. Now I and quite a number of other players are already pointing it out. Priests shadow abilities need a vast improvement, fast. What is Wulven games going to do next?

[Index]

I'm sure Wizent's Staff will become a stupid card if Priest's ability is get improved...
I don't get it why you think Priest heroes need a buff when you are even not Priest player though... maybe it's because you haven't met a good enough Priest player yet?

[kraken]

I can see and understand maybe adjusting Jericho's ability, but not Zhanna's. Zhanna in the right hands is pretty scary (and hard to beat) with all the draw cards that are available to priest heroes. Index mentioned the big staple of wizent staff. Then you have Elizabeth (priest exclusive ally). On top of that priest have access to tainted oracle, honored dead, bazaar, and bad santa. That's a TON of draw options.