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  1. #51
    Senior Member Killtrend's Avatar
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    In this game of no seperate mana, think of all encounters this way: the hero can only bring members of his faction with him. Once on the battlefield, allies and spells may be coerced or learned that otherwise he wouldn't have access to.
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  2. #52
    Senior Member Black Sithis's Avatar
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    How about keep it as it is (maybe +1 cost?) and destroy a resource, like SoV?

  3. #53
    Senior Member Killtrend's Avatar
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    So that would leave elemental decks with one less resource, but it would be in the same vein of cheap cards with the extra cost of the players own resource. I could see a branch of cards coming out with cheap costs and that stigma.

    Here is my thoughts on Transference if it is indeed being nerfed. I think most will agree this keeps the card playable and powerful, while being fair to everyone.

    Transference - Cost 3

    "Draw two cards from TARGET players deck. Show the cards to your opponent and remove Transference card from the game."

    With this wording, transfer can't be abused by loop decks, your opponent sees the cards AND it still gives the caster options. All ownership rules apply for Graveyards always and there is no need to worry.
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  4. #54
    Senior Member shannong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killtrend View Post
    So that would leave elemental decks with one less resource, but it would be in the same vein of cheap cards with the extra cost of the players own resource. I could see a branch of cards coming out with cheap costs and that stigma.

    Here is my thoughts on Transference if it is indeed being nerfed. I think most will agree this keeps the card playable and powerful, while being fair to everyone.

    Transference - Cost 3

    "Draw two cards from TARGET players deck. Show the cards to your opponent and remove Transference card from the game."

    With this wording, transfer can't be abused by loop decks, your opponent sees the cards AND it still gives the caster options. All ownership rules apply for Graveyards always and there is no need to worry.
    I liked your other idea better, lol. See Transference - How to best fix it? Take 2 for why.
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  5. #55
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    Ok. Its very simple maths.

    It used to be 3 mana, I keep card parity, my opponent -1. So that is +1 card advantage.
    I trade 1 card for 1 burn spell/creature/resource fodder(which are lacking in the elemental deck TBH). Hence I get an increase in card quality.

    Verdict = Play 4.

    Now it is 3 mana, I keep card parity, my opponent -0. So that is +0 card advantage.
    I trade 1 card for 1 burn spell/creature/resource fodder(which are lacking in the elemental deck TBH). Hence I get an increase in card quality.
    Verdict = Play 2 in the elementalis control deck. As a way to run my opponent out of cards.

    I will not call it completely unplayable, since it used to raw and insane disruption. Now its just simply part of your decking engine. You do your feedback/recursion/bad santa/transference loop still. Just that you don't blindly cast it on turn 3 and have it act like a stupor.

    And no, revealing the card makes no sense. You want an MTG analogy, think fateseal.

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by shannong View Post
    I'll try again, lol, to 'splain why I think it's too much advantage to have a +1 card advantage PLUS the ability to remove not 1x, but 2x cards from your opponent's deck without them having any clue what those 2x cards were until they finally deck themselves:

    Say your deck revolves around weapon use. Like, oh... say... Calmdown's Victor deck of DOOM!

    What's that you say? "But his deck has like a bazillion different bows in it! Who cares if 4x of them get stolen? His deck is built to not care how many bows get killed by item destruction or by being stolen!

    Yes, but....

    What if it's been a hard game and you're both down to like 6x cards left in your respective decks. You've got a bow in hand and trying to decide whether to taunt out a possible item destruction card you think your opponent might be holding. Your TACTICAL DECISION in this moment relies heavily on having counted how many bows you've already drawn and played, and therefore how many bows might still be sitting in your remaining 6-card deck.

    This is what I'm talking about. What if the 2 bows you think you still have left aren't even there? Wouldn't that *greatly* affect what you do with the bow in your hand right now?
    I've played that deck extensively and I can assure you I'd much rather you steal the bows I MIGHT have in my deck than the ones I'm SURELY holding in my hand. By late game, your hand is ONLY bows, so the original Transferance is much more annoying.

    Also I don't know why you whine so much about a mechanic that lets you draw from your opponent without them knowing what you drew. Have not seen Dimension Ripper? Everytime you do damage you and your opponent draw from each other's deck blind. No one whines about it, because it's terrible. Granted you're also subjected to the effect, but as an Elemental I'd much rather draw from my deck that from my opponents'.

  7. #57
    Senior Member N3rd4Christ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tk5 View Post
    All interesting points. One thing I will say in its favour: if the card taken is not revealed then the elemental player has an element of surprise against a non elemental deck. For instance an elemental could pocket a super nova and keep it up their sleeve until needed- opponent will not know elemental has that option and so commit allies or not calculate elemental damage available correctly etc. I know instead of a nova it could be a snake but... Anyway it still gives access to cards that can't be used as default in an elemental deck which may give an advantage..

    My concerns: future decisions on owner/controller definitions- will retreating a transferred ally cause ally to return to original owner? and which graveyard does a spent card go to? If it returns to original owners GY then against a resurrecting priest an ally may be better sacrificed, making transferring pretty pointless.
    Or you can pocket a Fire Snake.... Keep it under the sleve and have it bite you int he behind!
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  8. #58
    Senior Member N3rd4Christ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tk5 View Post
    My concerns: future decisions on owner/controller definitions- will retreating a transferred ally cause ally to return to original owner? and which graveyard does a spent card go to? If it returns to original owners GY then against a resurrecting priest an ally may be better sacrificed, making transferring pretty pointless.
    Personally i think it should. That is what makes sense and would make retreat more usefull vs stolen allies.
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  9. #59
    Senior Member yaemon's Avatar
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    lol just read about the card effect change, it should just be renamed to "Garbage" now.
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